Wait, a lot of people in the West would agree with this outcome due to fanboyism or ignorance so how could it be trolling if it doesn't make them angry?
RNGCombo said: Wait, a lot of people in the West would agree with this outcome due to fanboyism or ignorance so how could it be trolling if it doesn't make them angry?
What made the Japanese Katana surperior in some respects, if my knowledge of them is correct, is the strength of the steel, it's ability to keep a keenly sharp edge after repeated cuts (through tissue and bone alike) as well as it's light an easier handling. I recall hearing from somewhere that the European or western swords functioned more as a bludgeoning weapon rather than a slicing or cutting weapon like the Katana. Of course I could be wrong, however one thing is for sure, you can't cut a blade in two like that, at best you'll be able to make a chip in it, or a noticeable ding in the blade
I don't even know if the original post was meant to be a trolling device as more it was a joke-"Lol Check this out" kind of comment that started this whole argument
I seem to notice that most steel/iron objects can take stress in one way but not another
Forged Piston Rods can well exceed 1000 horse power of force downward on the rod it self, but once you bend it sideways, it brake
While the Katana is Strong shortways, they are brittle Longways, bending them will make them brake I hear
and Yes, the Katana was designed and refined for Cutting and Chopping Two Handed, upper hand of the handle drives, lower hand on the handle pulls, Cutting
Artimise said: What made the Japanese Katana surperior in some respects(...)
Really, the light weight is one of the only advantages a katana has. The steel isn't of better quality - in fact, the legendary forging techniques of Japan came about because of an astoundingly low quality of steel, and a lack of native iron (thus the need to use as little of it as possible). They're not very durable at all, and require frequent care and honing.
Western longswords (to use the most typical example) are by comparison heavier, clumsier, but much more durable. They are, however, just as sharp. And then you pick up a rapier, and the weight advantage of a katana is nullified. Then, it's all down to technique, skill, and experience.
That's it. I'm sick of all this "Masterwork Bastard Sword" bullshit that's going on in the d20 system right now. Katanas deserve much better than that. Much, much better than that.
I should know what I'm talking about. I myself commissioned a genuine katana in Japan for 2,400,000 Yen (that's about $20,000) and have been practicing with it for almost 2 years now. I can even cut slabs of solid steel with my katana.
Japanese smiths spend years working on a single katana and fold it up to a million times to produce the finest blades known to mankind.
Katanas are thrice as sharp as European swords and thrice as hard for that matter too. Anything a longsword can cut through, a katana can cut through better. I'm pretty sure a katana could easily bisect a knight wearing full plate with a simple vertical slash.
Ever wonder why medieval Europe never bothered conquering Japan? That's right, they were too scared to fight the disciplined Samurai and their katanas of destruction. Even in World War II, American soldiers targeted the men with the katanas first because their killing power was feared and respected.
So what am I saying? Katanas are simply the best sword that the world has ever seen, and thus, require better stats in the d20 system. Here is the stat block I propose for Katanas:
(One-Handed Exotic Weapon) 1d12 Damage 19-20 x4 Crit +2 to hit and damage Counts as Masterwork
(Two-Handed Exotic Weapon) 2d10 Damage 17-20 x4 Crit +5 to hit and damage Counts as Masterwork
Now that seems a lot more representative of the cutting power of Katanas in real life, don't you think?
tl;dr = Katanas need to do more damage in d20, see my new stat block.
(a) Katana are not designed to be used in the sort of swordplay we're used to in the west. You would not clash katana together at all, they'd break. (b) Bitches don't know about Damascus steel.
workworkwork said: Even in World War II, American soldiers targeted the men with the katanas first because their killing power was feared and respected.
You forgot to mention why they lost the war too, they got a little careless and split some atoms with em.
Fencedude said: I like how no one mentions that his Katana breaks later in the episode.
Several times a katana broke. One of the characters even said technique and footwork were what mattered when using a katana, since they'd chip and break easily if used bluntly. And there's still a long way to go in the series. I wouldn't be surprised if other weapons and smithing techniques were introduced along the way. Certainly there's no reason to think that the sacred sword will be a katana, just because Cecily is enamored by them at the moment (she's a knight, has she no pride?).
I honestly train in swordsmanship (Italian and German mostly) so I've tried my hands at a large variety of swords. From my experience of handling nihontos I can honest say some ways it is better than some European swords. However I can honestly say its a very one dimensional sword. It’s fast, accurate, lightweight, well sharpened, and unexpectedly tough. That being said I would not say they are the best swords. Their sharpness isn’t really that much better than a typical arming sword or two hand long sword. The weight is also similar but (this is just my opinion most likely) European swords seem to a much better feel of balance to them, which make them feel lighter when handled correctly. On another note European swords tend to give you more options. Its blade was designed to both cut and smash simultaneously for fighting opponents wearing layered steel plate and chain armor, however if the blades weight was to light using certain techniques gives the swords cross guard the ability to function sort of like pickaxe or like a scythe for hooking, sweeping, and pulling. The pommels were also scary. They were built to be light as a counter balance but solid enough to smash concrete turning it in to something of a miniature club. Also European blades don't have a one way of forging because of all the countries on that one continent. In fact did you know that the Vikings a highly similar way of forging swords like the Japanese? Or that they applied their forging methods to other euro countries swords? And as far as material went they would iron, different types of steels, and wootz and or Damascus steel, it depends. Look I'm not here to get in some kind sword argument with people I'm just saying what I know from hands on experience. Because no matter what sword you use it will come to the person wielding it. Doesn't matter if its katana, Messer, arming sword, great sword whatever. It doesn't mean damn thing to have caliber weapon if its wielder is can't handle it. A weapon doesn't make the man the man makes the weapon.
Compairing a Katana to any western double edged straight sword is pointless. Its like compairing the chinese Jian with the Chinese Dao; THEY ARE TWO DIFFERENT WEAPONS!!! While katana are both durable and keep a good edge, they are designed to keep a sharp slicing edge. A "bastard sword" or a European longsword are supposed to have a heavy blade, that has relatively dull edges but maintain a sharp point and have a heavy blade. This is meant to pierce. This pic isn't about the superiority of a katana, but the superiority of the craftsmanship and swordsman.
Axier said: Compairing a Katana to any western double edged straight sword is pointless. Its like compairing the chinese Jian with the Chinese Dao; THEY ARE TWO DIFFERENT WEAPONS!!! While katana are both durable and keep a good edge, they are designed to keep a sharp slicing edge. A "bastard sword" or a European longsword are supposed to have a heavy blade, that has relatively dull edges but maintain a sharp point and have a heavy blade. This is meant to pierce. This pic isn't about the superiority of a katana, but the superiority of the craftsmanship and swordsman.
I believe what you are trying to say a sword is a sword but every sword has a certain purpose or strong characteristics. However I must say that not all Hand-and-Half a.k.a a "bastard swords" are as heavy and dull as you think. I know because I have two. And one of them is barely 2 lbs while the other weighs about 10 lbs, and both are razor sharp. You are correct though; this pic is about craftsmanship superiority. Anyone who views any other way is ignorant.
never thought i would see this anywhere else but 4chan. Anyway idk why the katanah is always depicted in anime as the superior weapon out of the japanese arsenal. Seriously what about the Yoichi bow or the naginata, hell the Kanobo was one of the most feared weapons there for shear smashing power that's why they attribute it with the oni.
I think we have to think about the style of combat the respective swords were being used for. When really thinking about the durability of the sword, the Katana I suppose would indeed fall short in some areas, as fore mentioned by another poster, due to the lack of raw materials for sword smiths. Now my knowledge of japanese armor is not the best, so dont take my word for fact, but the japanese did not use a lot of metal in their armor. The style of combat relied alot on the wielder being able to remain fairly agile while being moderately armored in medium to thin armor, that being comprised mostly of overlapping strips of leather or a combination of leather and iron plates or some other metal of the time. Thus the need for a heaver weapon I don't think was required, nor did the art of Bushido really utilize it. (not sure) On the other hand, Europeans had to cut through mail and plate armor, and iron or steel shields were frequently seen in combat, thus an entirely different blade would most likely be needed to suit the needs of combat being seen in that era. So when it really boils down to it, yes the Katana does have some advantages, however so do any European sword, it all depends on what scenario the weapons are being used in. To be honest, if it came down to how mobile the combatants are, the Wielder of the Katana may pose a slight advantage over say, a European warrior in medium to heavy armor. Who can say, but thats just my take on it.
Well, to be fair, western-style swords recieve a fair amount of respect in anime and manga. Many prominient and famous characters use them. Now, if we were talking about how ridiculed and worthless armor is, that'd be a criticism worth making, although, you don't have to be Japanese to be biased against full suits of armor. Fat guys in armor are a stereotype everywhere.
Hyperion_Zero said: Only ceremonial swords weigh that much. Two handed swords are considered very heavy at 4-6 lbs. A 10 lbs sword simply isn't practical.
The 10 pound one is what you consider a "war sword" or a "battlefield sword". It's about 55" tall and is meant to be used in wide-open spaces. However with the hand-and-half hilt it is a challenge to handle at first, and because of its height and weight a person of average build and strength can't use it appropriately. But I've owned and practice with it before I was even 10 years old and grew to an appropriate size and strength. Now it's weight feels pretty standard while an average sword feels too light. But your right, it's pretty impractical so I only really use it for basic training.
